More RPM = more windings or stronger magnets ?

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More RPM = more windings or stronger magnets ? pogo 09-07-2008
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Posted by pogo on September 7, 2008, 11:40 pm


Here's my "question of the week":

Suppose I have a DC motor that I can either modify the strength or number of
magnets; or modify the number of windings. Given that
I can only use 12 VDC, what would be the best way to increase RPM - assuming
torque is not even an issue ?

Stronger or more magnets ? More windings? Less windings ? Remember that is has
to stay with a 12 vdc power source.

Thanks!
JCD


Posted by HardySpicer on September 8, 2008, 2:16 am


On Sep 8, 3:40 pm, "pogo"
> Here's my "question of the week":
> Suppose I have a DC motor that I can either modify the strength or number of
magnets; or modify the number of windings. Given that
> I can only use 12 VDC, what would be the best way to increase RPM - assuming
torque is not even an issue ?
> Stronger or more magnets ? More windings? Less windings ? Remember that is has
to stay with a 12 vdc power source.
> Thanks!
> JCD

For a given torque the Power developed at the armature is WT where W
is the speed and T is the developed torque.
Is this a shunt,series or separately excited machine?

Anyway, to get more speed you need more power and the back emf E =WT.
Hence E must be increased.

However E is proportional to flux X W so that if the flux is increased
E will increase and hence the speed.
So you need more magnets! This will also increase the torque since it
is proportional to flux X armature current.
Simply a bigger motor (with larger magnetic field) has more speed
unless you increase the armature voltage which could damage the motor.

Hardy

Posted by HardySpicer on September 8, 2008, 2:30 am


> On Sep 8, 3:40 pm, "pogo"
> > Here's my "question of the week":
> > Suppose I have a DC motor that I can either modify the strength or number of
magnets; or modify the number of windings. Given that
> > I can only use 12 VDC, what would be the best way to increase RPM - assuming
torque is not even an issue ?
> > Stronger or more magnets ? More windings? Less windings ? Remember that is
has to stay with a 12 vdc power source.
> > Thanks!
> > JCD
> For a given torque the Power developed at the armature is WT where W
> is the speed and T is the developed torque.
> Is this a shunt,series or separately excited machine?
> Anyway, to get more speed you need more power and the back emf E =WT.
> Hence E must be increased.
> However E is proportional to flux X W so that if the flux is increased
> E will increase and hence the speed.
> So you need more magnets! This will also increase the torque since it
> is proportional to flux X armature current.
> Simply a bigger motor (with larger magnetic field) has more speed
> unless you increase the armature voltage which could damage the motor.
> Hardy

Did you believe that?

No? Well you are right. Here is teh true story.

V-E =Ir where r is armature resistance V is armature voltage (fixed)
and E is back emf.

Now E =const (sayk) X flux X W

hence speed W directly proportional to (V-Ir)/flux

Hence you need to REDUCE the flux to increase the speed. This is known
as field weakening and with a shunt connection you can do it easily by
adding a resistor in teh field. I suppose you can do something similar
if you have a separately excited field. This sounds counter intuative
but it is the case. It will increase the losses in teh field and
reduce the efficiency of course.


Posted by Peter Wallace on September 8, 2008, 11:09 am


On Sun, 07 Sep 2008 23:40:12 -0400, pogo wrote:

> Here's my "question of the week":
>
> Suppose I have a DC motor that I can either modify the strength or number of
magnets; or modify the number of windings. Given that
> I can only use 12 VDC, what would be the best way to increase RPM - assuming
torque is not even an issue ?
>
> Stronger or more magnets ? More windings? Less windings ? Remember that is has
to stay with a 12 vdc power source.
>
> Thanks!
> JCD

Fewer (and thicker) armature windings = not easy...


Posted by pogo on September 8, 2008, 4:27 pm


> On Sun, 07 Sep 2008 23:40:12 -0400, pogo wrote:
>> Here's my "question of the week":
>> Suppose I have a DC motor that I can either modify the strength or number of
magnets; or modify the number of windings. Given
>> that
>> I can only use 12 VDC, what would be the best way to increase RPM - assuming
torque is not even an issue ?
>> Stronger or more magnets ? More windings? Less windings ? Remember that is
has to stay with a 12 vdc power source.
>> Thanks!
>> JCD
> Fewer (and thicker) armature windings = not easy...
Can you actually provide an answer ?
Thanks!


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